Martin tells Shalini, among many other topics, about the significance of understanding a patient’s life and personal history in the context of regression therapy for diseases like prostate cancer.
Transcript
Shalini:
Hello and welcome to Estafet, where we interview EARTh members and get them introduced to the community. After a long trip to Romania, now we are in Germany meeting Martin Roesch. Dear Martin, a hearty and warm welcome.
Martin:
Well, Shalini, great there doing this work. Lovely.
Shalini:
Looking forward to hear lot and lot things from you, and more about your work.
Martin:
Yeah, what helps me most is actually working with, with patients, with clients and in doing the work on a regular base year by year. This is where you learn. We learn with our clients. Yes, we need an education in, in, in the beginning, but it is life that teaches us and we are privileged to get to know their experience. So you don’t need to, to, to live all yourself. So this is where I really feel the inspiration and the, the advancement that comes. And as I, as, as you may know, I’m working almost exclusively with cancer patients. So that is a bit a delicate thing because you feel, wow, this was a great session. But then you have a, a so-called objective response. How is the cancer doing? How is it developing? So you know that a great session which you think might be a turn around, may not be, may need more. So that’s quite interesting and you need some years to understand what what effects come in addition. So. But I enjoy this so-called objective feedback.
Shalini:
And how do you receive this feedback?
Martin:
In just in just watching how, how the disease proceeds and as well, I’m part of a very, very special tumor board, international tumor board that takes up palliative cases and with new methods. So, I’m not the expert there. They are pathologists and molecular genetic guys and guys from Israel, from London, from all over. And I’m so fascinated to learn advances in medicine as well. But that’s not our theme. Shalini, we humans, we are body, mind and spirit. And medicine takes care of the body, which is perfectly OK, but there is a big potential in mind and spirit as well. And if you carefully look like body medicine actually treats symptoms, the surgeon cuts it off. Radiation just destroys the DNA and chemotherapy inhibits cell proliferation. But the question how come I experience this? What makes me what makes me exposed to this experience in life. It’s not part of medicine. And I hope that in about two generation this will be included in the medical treatment because there is a a really big potential in understanding. There is no accident what happens to us and then and to unfold this and and try to I said before, if you replace the word problem by the word pattern, you already have a big step and you will see that the health issue sometimes follows the same pattern than in other areas of life.
Shalini:
Martin, the lot of work you do for cancer patient with cancer patients listen to their messages. I want to know more about how do you listen to that message? How do you see as a therapist and when you receive it, how do you put it across? How do you transfer? How do you tell it to your clients? Because somebody in pain and you know, not that receptive to listen that it’s only my body. So how to receive the message of mind and spirit and how to convey to the patients?
Martin:
For one, I see my task in I’m definitely not a healer healer. I don’t want to be a healer, but I want to hold the mirror. I want to hold the mirror, Shalini, that you or the person can recognize itself and maybe the deeper layers. And one such way is in a meditation. I never say hypnosis, meditation, you can start traveling your body and when you’re inside with your awareness and your consciousness, you meet the heart. Who tells that the heart doesn’t have a consciousness on its own. If you think it doesn’t have a consciousness on its own, you will find it to be valid. But if you’re open, you may find to your surprise that you get in a communication. Actually, you get in a communication with answers that surprise you. And very same, very similar with tumor cells, like when you’re imagining you’re in front of the tumor. I’m asking what are the impressions? For instance, they are very busy, they’re running back and forth. They don’t recognize me. So, you’re that the, the inner movie. So, you repeat these things to the client and then you, you tell him, well, do you want to, do you want to try to, to, to say hello to one of these cells? Just say hello, hello. How do they react? Well, he, he’s irritated, he doesn’t reply, but he he stops and looks at me. So this is when the whole thing starts. You just follow the flow. I don’t need to do anything. I just offer the frame for a communication. And sometimes that’s interesting. Celini. Sometimes a humor talks German or English in your mind, but sometimes it’s like a communication with an alien. Like if you would communicate with an octopus, you have no language, but you have senses, you feel then you have to switch. You have to. I had a client, she recognized the, the tumor cells like the color blue, so she imagined blue and they lightened up. So that’s a very, very funny thing of communication, of suddenly going into feeling what, what do they want? What do they need? And sometimes they know their purpose and you can bluntly ask them, and sometimes they have no idea. It’s just the way it is. We need to grow. But why you, you, you need to grow? I don’t know. You know what? Let’s look at the cause. And once you are at the point that you can communicate with like, cancer cells, that’s already a pretty good step. Then you can say, OK, I change position, I’m standing next to you and we both look in the same direction. And I help you now with my consciousness because I imagine I pull down a screen, an empty screen, and my task is just to count to three. At 1, you see the screen, at two you see a blank white light on the screen. And at 3, and I ask the universe or the client asked the universe to display the cause. And at 3, the image comes 1,2, 3. And the client says, for instance, oh, I see a woman, a young woman, she smiles, she holds her, her head tilted. Oh, that’s my granny. And here you’re already in the story epigenetic influences. So, it’s actually all, it’s all available in the client’s consciousness. And you need just to be like a, a midwife. But you’re not doing things. I’m not doing things. I’m just holding the mirror and Shalini, I feel if I would, I know there are people around and I’ve met people that are energetically very powerful and they can move things. But if you would do this and there was a reason why the universe exposed you to that experience, it is something to understand, to learn. So, if it would just take it away, the universe would take a lot of effort to bring you to the point again to to learn to start. What is it about that I need to develop on? So, then I think the task is really to help the client see the matter herself, himself, and then do the appropriate changes. And me, I’m, I’m just a facilitator, just holding the mirror.
Shalini:
And how did the clients respond after this mirror and seeing the story?
Martin:
Well, I think it’s- it can be quite powerful. And as I said before, I recognised I was like years ago, I was jubilant. Wow. We found the point and we really found the point. But that does not mean the tumor disappears because you need to really find the resources to walk the talk to, to change your attitudes. And again, Shalini, if you look, there is few, little, but there is few research on so-called spontaneous remissions. That means a person in a palliative final stage. But you find these cases where all of a sudden, the tumor disappears. Now it’s interesting to investigate why is this happening and and medicine says spontaneous remission, remission, which is just an expression I have. I have not the clue why it disappeared. It just disappeared. And if you look at these cases, you’ll find there’s Kelly Hirschberg, an American, there is Joe Dispenza, there is Kelly Turner. There are few people and my experience is as well. You always find throughout different tumor entities, ages, social classes, one common denominator, and that is there was a significant change in either lifestyle, in a life attitude, in a belief system or in a in a core thing that was part of part of history, part of conditioning that changed. So, for instance, I’m not worth it. Everybody disregards me. That’s the old pattern. And to realize it’s not true. That’s an example of such a a big change, but that is actually the big step. It’s not the recognition, it’s the ability to walk the talk.
Shalini:
And that’s what transforms.
Martin:
And that is what transforms, yeah. And it helps to know it, but it needs to be experienced in order to, to really have the impact to make a change.
Shalini:
So once the people or the clients are the people who are going through this pattern of cancer, once they come to you, they see the change, they feel that they start walking. But what about the people who are yet to come to this field to to be your client or to experience this? I mean, my question is how do people see this field of regression therapy?
Martin:
This is a aspect of my work because like a regression therapist, people come and visit a regression therapist. They are open for the idea of regression. My client by and large are not open to the feel of regression. They have a cancer they don’t care about and they sometimes they have strong religious beliefs and past like what’s past life? If I would come and talk about past life in the beginning, I would get a big crown. Hey, this is not what what what relates to me. So, I have to start differently and I start mentally or with the body or energy work or whatever. But you have to quickly, like in the first session, you have to bring them in an in an own experiencing and in a recognition that says, oh, that’s interesting. That’s something I feel needs to be developed further. Then you have the the hook, so to say. And so some are many of the techniques focus on just starting to get an experience. A very simple thing, very simple in the meditation, I’m asking a patient to be in a, in a ego state room or in a, in a, on a meadow and find a mirror. You find a mirror; you look into the mirror. And I would say in about 50% of all cases, you don’t see yourself the way you are in the mirror. So, you have already a hookup. And I mean it’s the client says I, I don’t see myself or I, I just see a dark shadow in the mirror. So, I’m not trying to convince or to teach anything. Hey, so we work with and we are already in the session. And even if you find yourself as a mirror, I can say now with your hands, you go inside the mirror and you split the image apart in one aspect that is all of you that is healthy and the other side all the burdensome, troublesome aspects. And it’s interesting what appears in the imagination of the client. And here you go. That’s because consciousness we sometimes we are longing for a connect to the to the upper world, to the higher self, to the universe, to God or whatsoever. But very similar, our cells, our organs are longing for the connect to us. You are queen consciousness to your body. So instead of being angry with your stomach that it disturbs you that it has a cancer, if you go there, if you visit it, if you, if you are there, this already has a lot of potential of pacifying, of being understood, what needs to be understood here again in the session already.
Shalini:
Beautiful, very beautiful.
Martin:
Yeah, I, I really feel this, this should be something which which should be added to chronicle diseases or like autoimmune diseases, these kind of things.
Shalini:
Beautiful, yes. How do doctors respond to this? How this is the medical community? Do you have any tie up with them?
Martin:
The medical community had its own toolbox. Yeah. They have years of experience. And then they know what they’re doing. That’s that’s fine. I always say if you have a hammer in your hand, every problem looks like a nail. So, this is why there are tumor conferences, because if you go to a surgeon, he will tell you surgery. If you go to oncologist, he will tell you chemotherapy, etcetera. So, you need to have a group of people to share the knowledge and and not have one be dominant. So, they have their toolbox and I’m working complementary. So this is important to me. I’m not saying I’m doing something alternative. It’s fine if I cut myself, I put a plaster, I fix it that that’s totally fine. But in addition, you can think about what can you do with the potential of mind and spirit. And that’s a true complementary aspect. And I get predominantly most my clients, I get referred from oncologists that over the years got to know me.
And Shalini, this is interesting to me now. Now I’m getting invited to oncological conferences. And like five years ago, it would have not been imaginable. And the first one that invited me said I’m, I really would like you to have a, a talk and a presentation, But I fear that my colleagues would criticize me, that I put some exotic things on the agenda. So, he dared to do it. He got really- very positive feedback and that that was was happy for him. And now I have three invitations to oncological conferences. So, it starts gradually slowly.
Shalini:
And that’s so impactful that it becomes the component of holistic healing.
Martin:
It is, yeah, I think so. It is, yeah. And it is no conflict to medicine that’s important. Yeah.
Shalini:
Even the patients are not in conflict because they are also accepting it holistically along with the treatment. Yeah, they don’t have to choose between the two.
Martin:
Yeah, sometimes there is a little conflict. So, for instance, if you recognize the pattern of a person is to stand up for herself, to really stand up for herself. And now there is the professor that says chemotherapy. It’s like big daddy that said you need to do this and this. And your feel is no, it it doesn’t feel correct that that chemotherapy, then you might have a conflict. But the point is to strengthen yourself in that fictive example. But it’s not really as fictive. It occurs quite quite once in a while. So, you have to stand up living for you and you have to prove it to the world, to the reality in the field of partnership with your spouse, with your husband in the field of health, standing up against a professor and saying this is what I want, etcetera. So that’s walk the talk. Now, once you recognize I need to look for myself, you need to really set it into action.
Shalini:
That’s amazing. That’s nice. I got to hear. I’m not sure that you’re writing a book. Also, because this work needs publication for people.
Martin:
Point is, I’m, I’m actually fully booked and I decided for quality of life that I will take off Friday now and not do appointments on Friday. And because I feel this is this is really a contribution, this really can help people. I would like to to train or my experience that if you are a regression therapist, you have already a lot tool set and it doesn’t need much more just the experience of focusing of these chronicle medical areas. There are some aspects that are have evolved that are fruitful, that are helpful and that I want to to teach, I want to communicate.
And Tülin from Turkiye, she gave me the opportunity of doing a workshop just, I think it was just for two days, to her Turkish therapists and I was teaching some of these aspects. And then we had a session intervision. So, they were setting it to practice. And we came together by soon talking about their experience. And I was thrilled to see that they all tried, they all found clients and there was much more desire to share what they experienced then there was time available. So, this is really, I’m thankful for Tulin, to allow this and I’m doing this now in Spain and I hope to reach Latin America, as well. I hope by this way and the book to to summarize it in writing, can help spread these techniques to put it to action put it to to to more volume. Yeah.
Shalini:
Yes, absolutely. So, when is the book coming?
Martin:
Well, I wanted it to, to, to, to be finished by the end of the year. And the last two months I, I was fully full with, with patience. So, I have to cut it out a little bit. It will come, yes. I I still hope by the end of the year we’ll have it.
Shalini:
I will wish there would be more and more workshop in many, many countries because the way the cancer is spreading, the made, the number is increasing. We need more and more knowledge on the work you are doing, Martin.
Martin:
Yeah, yeah. And we have this is lovely with EARTh. I think EARTh is a a great organization. And when I first met at the first conference, I felt like it was a feeling like being at home because with oncologists, I always have to hide myself to be still compatible to them. And now all of a sudden or they were all like minded people. And the schools that developed in the various countries, they train therapy. So, they know already much of this basic stuff that we are way more than our body, that we are souls, we have a higher consciousness, etcetera. So, with this prerequisite, this spiritual background, it’s easy to to add these little elements that are helpful to work with, with bodily issues, cancer patients, etcetera. So maybe in the future some schools will will just give a workshop where they can add these well things that are helpful in in working with such kind of clients.
Shalini:
Yes, absolutely. And it would happen soon, I’m sure. What is your message for EARTh Association and what’s your message for fellow therapists?
Martin:
Well, a message to EARTh and to therapists. So, in amendment to restricting ourselves to the material observable world, we need to expand into the reality beyond. And EARTh is a pioneer in this approach. And like with any pioneers, you’re standing out there on your own and you get a hit on your head. But years later, these pioneers are the frontiers and they are cherished. And we need, we are still very much in the pioneer phase, but we need this, we need to understand that there is way more than the graspable material reality and that many influences that come to that point are actually the, the forceful ones and EARTh and its member of the therapists, they are just working and detecting and finding and recognizing and, and learning how to deal with them. So that’s lovely. I I really am thrilled that this organization exists and it it expands, it needs to expand.
Shalini:
I love that. I love the way we put it across, and this needs to expand. EARTh is expanding, but still so much more is needed. And now I will request whom you want to invite the next for the interview.
Martin:
It would be Trisha [Caetano], as Alexandra already mentioned, and Trisha is an expert in inner child therapy. And my question to Trisha would be, how would she go about in severe cases where a client does not have a memory on childhood, like it was a severe trauma in childhood up to the point that such a client is not even capable of going into trance.
I have such a person right now. And I’m asking, close your eyes. Can you imagine standing on a meadow? No, she can’t. She can’t even imagine. Well, look outside. Look at your garden. close your eyes. Can you imagine standing on your garden? Yes. I can’t. No, I can’t anymore. Whoa. So much resistance. Even going into the process.
How would she handle such cases? I mean, obviously it’s a resistance, but out of a protection for herself. So how would she go about creating the trust to enable her clients, heavy clients to move into?
Shalini:
That’s a very interesting question. And the way Trisha deals with clients, the way that we have witnessed in the workshop, it’s really beautiful and it would be really amazing to listen about this.
And it’s really nice that you have taken time to discuss about this. And it’s really, really matters. Even when fellow therapists listen about your experiences and about your association, even if the medical fraternity now, it gives them more confidence and more, you know.
Martin:
And most, most important actually is listening to cases or learning cases, which we didn’t know in this little interview, but this is actually the the, the insightful way to to open up, yes, interest.
Shalini:
Thank you so much, Martin, I love talking to you and thank you so much and all the earth members. I hope you enjoyed and all the people who are not yet members. Maybe you also get the inspiration to be the member of this beautiful community we have as EARTh.
Martin:
A great community, it’s a lot of fun.
Shalini:
Yes, a lot of fun, a lot of learning, a lot of positivity. There’s a place on Earth exists with a lot of positivity and that name is EARTh.
And next we will be meeting Trisha. If you have any question, you want to know, like Martin has already put up a very beautiful question, but if you have any question before the interview, please comment on the Facebook page or Insta page. Let us know. Thank you so much and thank you Martin, once again, lovely talk.
Martin:
Thank you, Bye bye.